6/16/09 UPDATE – See my most recent update here. . .
5/28/09 – UPDATE: See my latest blog post here. . .the saga continues, unfortunately.
5/5/09 – UPDATE: I’ve seen the letter from CMS dated 4/29 which advises the companies that they would be able to download the report on “New to Medicare” and “New to Medicare Advantage” enrollees so that the companies can pay the balance of the initial commissions. This also verified that only 1/1/09 effectives would be on the May 1st report and that they would be delivering the 2/1, 3/1 and 4/1 effectives through out the month of May. Then, starting in June and every month thereafter, they will be providing the report on the third week of the month. Example, 3rd week of June for the May effectives. From the description of the file, it seems rather straitforward, however, the insurance companies will need to do a bit of computer programming to get the first commissions out. After the initial programming, they should be able to pay the balance of initial commissions rather easily. I’m guessing the whole process should take no more than 2 weeks before you start seeing commissions on companies who pay direct. For companies who pay Ritter, we’ll forward the balance of initial commissions on our first run following receipt of payment which should be June 10th.
4/30/09 – EDITOR’S NOTE: If you read all comments below, you will see that the original date of April 28th has shifted to May 1st. Following is the original post from 4/19:
I just heard that this was announced by CMS last Friday, April 17th. I’ve only heard this from one company so far, so I’ll try to verify with some other carriers. The date for release of the payment information from CMS to the Insurance companies is April 28th.
As of Friday morning, I had heard from 5 companies that there was “no news” with regard to the second commission payment. Given that this news was just supposed to have broken, that might make some sense. Also, this is the first “exact date” I’ve seen, which is encouraging.
I’d expect that most companies will need a week or two to format the information and pay the agents, so I’d expect commissions to start flowing by mid May.
As I hear any more confirmation of this, I’ll add to this posting or add a Comment to the posting below.
Craig
After spending time reading many of your comments there are some main points such as getting paid, agents being victimized by companies, negative input to name a few.
Would it be possible to have agent survey of company performance on questions that would help agents make decisions on which companies to represent? There are many intangible things as you point to agent pay as one thing. There could be a wide amount of questions/ input to help us all.
Good companies like to be avaluated, and companies that could use help in defining areas of improvement would appreciate input.
I sometimes respond to surveys, the questions are usually short and precise. Companies do actually want to improve and be recognized for the good also.
Most of us don’t want to focus on the negative, but if we could get some good out of a collection of constructive criticism or have the ability to review ratings this could benefit agents, companies, and ultimately our consumers.
A good website to talk to other agents about these matters is http://www.insurance-forums.net!!
Sorry I haven’t written but I felt this site has changed in recent weeks, but then I realized that everyone is just becoming more and more jaded because of this unbearable situation. In response to you nay sayers who had so much to say about my posts I just want to say you are right a class action is not realistic, but we can take this fight to our local congressman. If we all put pressure and help them to realize our pain they will have no choice but to help. This link will help you locate your local reps http://www.staterepresentative/localdir.gov. They can’t help If they don’t know what’s going on if anything they can reach out to their brothers in the INS commisioners office and apply pressure to them to get involved. Remember the sneaky wheel gets the oil.
BTW has anyone other then Cecil been paid?
Big Dan –
I made no such claims. I am what I say I am however, and I dealt with what you said, not some imagined picture of what or who you are.
I actually work alone, a choice I made about 27 years ago, after dealing with agents whose ideas of what it meant to be an insurance agent differed greatly from my own.
If you wish to chastise me, try sticking to what I say, as I did with you, not what your fertile mind dreams up.
We rec’d NEW for 1/1/2009 from Coventry.
Actual money? Coventry told me they released funds last week and I haven’t seen a dime yet!
I’ve seen the commissions listed on the app tracker, but they haven’t hit my back acount yet either.
Have any of you received renewals from last year yet?
Yes, actual money that hit the bank account. I am still reviewing the detail as it appears that they may have paid on some that were in MA but due to getting a PPO this year they added RX or they consider that a significant plan change. Since CMS report, thinking it is how CMS dictated but hard to tell if an error or not. I believe we have also gotten renewals, still reviewing.
Thats good news! Thanks Brenda Jo, you give me something to look forward to! I hope all the rest get good news soon, it is getting a little vicious on this site!
That’s only one company though; I haven’t seen anything else and it seems some communications from companies are saying that the CMS file may have errors
I never know what to believe anymore and these constant changes and delays are frustrating. I long for the days of yesteryear when an insurance professional was treated like a professional. Kudos to companies like Coventry they and a few others at least are more agent friendly…
Hello, I am/was new to the MA insurance field as of 6 months ago. Luckily I got a new job recently and get to forget about all this BS I have been put through soon. Couple quick questions if anyone could help.
1) Has CMS released the initial enrollment lists yet? If so when should I EXPECT to see the money at the latest?
2) how long can an FMO hold commissions from an agent?
3) Is there any deadline for an FMO to disperse initial MA commissions?
4) FOR ONCE AND FOR ALL – ARE WE GETTING PAID INITIAL COMMISSIONS FOR SOMEONE WHO HAD ORIGINAL MEDICARE WITH A PDP?!
5) AND IF SO WHAT IF THEY WENT FROM A MAPD TO MED SUP WITH PDP BACK TO A MAPD??? THAT ONE WILL BLOW YOUR MIND!!!
Please someone with the correct answers let me know as I have been waiting for months for my FMO to pay me. He is upset that I got a new job and says he can hold my commissions up to one year to cover him from charge-backs. I thought the only reason a charge-back could occur after 3 months was for a chronic illness which are not even available in my county. Please help as I just started my new job and am so behind in bills right now. I am coming real close to driving down there and kicking the teeth out of this guy. Literally
Mike,
1) CMS has released the list. You should not expect to get paid because you’re a quitter. Your FMO probably terminated your contract as soon as you quit.
2) Unfortunatly, commission advances are a privalige not a right. You do have a contractual right to earn your commissions as earned providing that you have an active contract. If you continually write business for a carrier, that carrier has an incentive to advance your commish so your business with them can grow faster(with advances you can buy more leads, bigger office, etc.). Since you are no longer writing business with them, they will probably pay you the slow way. As earned. Or they won’t pay you at all because they terminated your contract because of “lack of production.”
3) Your FMO must pay you at minimum as earned month to month. They do not have to advance you the other six months. In your case, this is probably how you will get paid if they have not terminated your contract. This way ensures that they will not be responsible for any chargebacks.
4) Yes
5) Replacement commission
Actually, the CMS commissions are not listed as “advances”. That talk came later.
If something is an “advance” is is listed as a commission with a “(months or percentage of annual)” advance. None of the contracts I signed stated anything even approaching this language. It was, rather, a commission of the enrollment. No language in the contract says anything about back charges or the like. It is more like HMO’s pay to enroll members.
It is stupid beyond belief to call someone a “quitter” who left because he wasn’t being paid according to contract. That is NOT QUITTING, rather it is recognizing the breach in contract that exists by the failure to pay. And to condemn someone who complains about not being paid or imply that he should not be paid – you are a moron!
Hey Big Dan, from the sounds of it you are running your own FMO or should I saw ponzi scheme. OK, for one, I never told my FMO I was quitting. I am smarter then that and have tried to be nice in order to get money that is owed me. And I am still able to submit business, probably more, with my new job. I will be in doctors offices all day in which I will be able to leave MA marketing material with my cards at about 50 offices a week within a large radius. Since this is not a conflict of interest with either position I will be doing both. Just concentrating more on the new job as they are treating me very well with a salary plus commission. My FMO never did a thing for me except send me to health seminars set up by HMO’s. In which 90% of those no one showed. I came out of pocket for a lot of BS seminars and almost all of the business I submitted I got on my own. I have called United and others and asked when I should expect payment and they said it was sent out weeks/months ago. I tell all new enrollees’ to contact me first if they have any problems, and I make sure they are informed fully to all details of the plan they select. The reason why I went independent in the first place was to have all the best plans available for prospective members and let them make the right decision without steering them into one particular companies plans. By the way, Wellcare sucks. No wonder why their going down. When members called customer service Wellcare told them to call 1-800-Medicare. I’ll bet you anything they won’t be around taking aps next AEP.
I’m going to have to side with Big Dan on this one.
Mike you sound like a fly by night. First of all you said yourself your started 6 months ago and you already quit. You started off selling an insurance product subsidized by the government thinking everything was going to be swell b/c premiums were low and benefits were great. When the going got tough you ran to your mamma.
Now your talking about soliciting Medicare Advantage Plans in provider’s offices. You can’t do that it’s against CMS guidlines. This is the type of behavior that gives legitamate agents and the profession as a whole a bad name in the public eye. You should leave the business all together or at least stay away from Medicare products. This isn’t for rookies.
Look, your probably a young guy. I can tell because you’re talking about kicking your manager’s teeth out. Its obvious your still at the stage in life when you want to prove your manliness. We get it, you are really manly. And if you happen to be older than say 30 you have a lot of growing up to do… fast. You have your whole life ahead of you. You should spend it doing something you love and are good at. It sounds to me like you’d probably be good at selling used cars. You don’t need a lot of experience, and there aren’t to many rules and regulations you need to be mindfull of (since you don’t seem to care about them now, this would be perfect for you).
Don’t get me wrong, I hope you get paid what you’ve earned but the last thing the insurance industry needs is another “who struck jonny” fly by night.
Alexander … Mike may be a rookie, but I am not. I have been in this business since 1978. How about you? You putting Mike down is about as unprofessional as you can get. Yes, he did say some things he should not have. And yes, I expect hes young. However, in over 30 years i this business, I have NEVER seen insurers stick it to the agents who are bringing them business as they have with this product. I consider this to be what dishonors this business. A man (or woman) is suppose to be paid for what he does, and he (or she) is suppose to be paid according the the agreement. A contract does not allow one party to change it or add rules after the fact. If it did, it would not be a contract. Even an employer cannot do this, and there is no contract (in most cases). But this is exactly what is happening, and in my book, it makes the ones doing it guilty of major ethical lapses. In Mike’s case, it appears his FMO is simply not honoring the agreement. It is hardly surprising that Mike is upset. I would caution Mike to sign NO contracts in the future with commissions assigned to an FMO unless he can verify their honesty. And as for you, you sound like the type of person that I feel needs to leave the business. Sounds like you are the one who should be selling used cars. A man with no empathy in his soul is a man I have no use for.
Hey Alexander,
Thanks but no thanks i’ll fight my own battles. You just keep on selling my friend and keep doing it in an honest, compliance friendly manor.
But seriously we should stop with all the name calling and use this site to communicate any commissions that are paid. We are all adults and professionals. I’m sure Mr. Myers is a great ambassador to the industry with millions and millions of paid premium and many satisfied policyholders under his belt. He probably has a vibrant insurance practice with his own office on main st. with several agents working under him. And now that Mike is settled in his new job he found on craigslist peddeling urinal cakes at Dr.’s offices for his gracious boss that treats him so well, we can all move on to discuss whats really important, our commish.
Big Dan
Mike, he can try to hold your commissions. But it will not be legal if he does. You ought to figure out what that means you will need to do.
Hey Michael, thanks for the info and support. I spoke with United today and confirmed that charge-backs cannot occur after 3 months and 1 day of effective day of the plan. They also stated that “initial enrollment commissions” should be out sometime next month. I mainly wrote for United as they were big in my area and a lot of the smaller HMO’s I was appointed with started having problems. I have tried everything in my power to be reasonable to my FMO and told him that I would keep submitting business if he was to get me even caught up on half my commissions owed. He sent me a check for $200! I think it might be time to take further recourse. Maybe Judge Judy or one of the other dozen judges on daytime t.v:) But seriously, if anyone knows of an agency or number for me to call it would help tremendously.
Hey Big Dan and Alexander,
I came across this site in search of answers on maybe how to get at least part of the commissions owed to me. So excuse me for getting a little upset when I had late bills and some asshole owes me enough to pay my bills for a few months. I had gotten into this business because of a brother of mine who was a top agent in Wellcare last year loved his job. I would have gone captive agent if I would have known how working under an FMO wouldv’e turned out. And no, maybe I shouldn’t have mentioned that I would kick the guys teeth in, but in all honesty I did want to at the moment. I don’t need to prove my manliness Alexander, and since when is it not O.K. to leave trifolds and business cards at physicians offices. I’ve seen marketing material at every office I have ever been to. If I am wrong on that I will gladly cut up my license and mail it to ya. And excuse me for accepting a job offer which pays a nice salary, travel expenses, covers dinners, and better commission. And big Dan, I assume your big Dan because your a larger fellow, my new job entails recruiting physicians in which I get to take them to all the nice steak houses on the companys dime. Meet me outside of Del Friscos and I might throw you some grissel. I’m done worrying about these commissions, if they come they come. And by the way, I am a little younger with no kids and the good lord blessed me with an opprotunity right when I needed one most. I am the happyest I have ever been in my life. You guys bashing a fellow agent because he wants his commissions owed to him threw me for a loop! If you guys need me I’ll be in Vegas all next week at a swim up bar peeing my pants all day.
And Mr. Myers, thanks for being a voice of reason. I’m sure your a great agent and treat all clients with the respect they deserve.
I received my Jan. 1 effectives “second half” statement from Coventry today. I was paid 62% of what I should have been. CMS or Coventry missed on many and paid me on some that were “ineligible”. If your experience is the same with Coventry or other companies, we should all demand that MA plans press CMS to rewrite it’s policies and allow companies to pay complete commissions regardless. We should all demand that our congressional delegation press CMS to do the same. If we don’t, who will? CMS has evidently failed to authorize even the paltry reduced commissions we are due. How much more can we take? How can we continue to do this when we don’t know, when or how much we will be paid.
How were you paid?
Man that’s a real Sh*tty thing to do to agents. We have no doubt that WellCare puts the agent LAST and their shareholders first.
I heard rumors around the regional office that Today’s Options (Pyramid and American Progressive) were going to do the same thing. I wrote about 80 cases with them this season.
Can anyone confirm these rumors on TO?
By the way, what if you do not accept the amendment to the contract? Will you get paid as originally stated in your contract?
Big Dan
Dan,
The explanation to me was that we do not get a chance to agree to the amendment…It is just done.
Also, I was told that all the companies that wrote PFFS plans are doing the same thing.
Paying out as earned..
Is this legal? Since we did not sign anything initially..and I definetly would not have agreed to this contract…
Does anyone know?
LaToya,
In my opinion, no, it is not legal. I am not an attorney, and no doubt Wellpoints attorneys think it is, or at least calculates they can get away with it, which they likely can since we agents get no help on commission issues from our DOI’s. Few of us have the ability to go sue an insurer in their state of domicile.
Insurers have become very haughty in recent years. But as other industries where this has happened amply demonstrates, what goes around comes around.
I would suggest replacing the business next year with a carrier who honors their word. If they will cheat agents, it’s a safe bet they will cheat our clients – and they are not going to be happy with them anyway.
And when I say replace it, I mean find a better company and wholesale replace. And get every agent you know in the same boat to do the same thing.
Money is the only thing these people understand. Honesty and integrity, benchmarks of our industry for years and years – have all been forgotten with this new breed of executives.
LaToya:
My guess is that since they are exiting the PFFS market in 2010, they are looking to save some interest expense and potential chargebacks. Basically, I think they are burning bridges here, but maybe they feel it’s worth it.
Craig
Wellcare just sent an email saying…
WellCare will also pay the 2nd half of all PFFS first year commissions for those enrollments that CMS deemed as new to Medicare Advantage for 2009 (as reported by CMS) on an as-earned basis each month in the coming weeks.
Can they do this?
Answer to my own question…. WellCare Commissions said that they amended our contracts…
Here is the email… I am really done with WellCare at this point… I asked the Commissions Department why didn’t they tell us this upfront? Oppose to telling us we were getting our 2nd half payments before the end of the month…Their response was .. We don’t know.\\
Important News Regarding PFFS/PDP Compensation
Dear Valued Producer,
In an effort to minimize any debit balances that may occur as a result of WellCare’s recent announced intention to exit the PFFS market in 2010, effective with payments made on or after May 29, 2009, PFFS renewal commission will be paid as-earned each month. This new payment structure will replace the 100% annualized advance payment structure that is currently in place.
Additionally, WellCare will also pay the 2nd half of all PFFS first year commissions for those enrollments that CMS deemed as new to Medicare Advantage for 2009 (as reported by CMS) on an as-earned basis each month in the coming weeks.
Since all PDP commissions are generated through the same system as the PFFS commissions, PDP new business and renewal compensation will also be paid as-earned each month.
CCP commission payments are unaffected by this process change and WellCare will continue to pay 100% annualized advance payment for 1st year and renewal commissions.
Please keep in mind, all commission payments are subject to rules set forth in WellCare’s producer contract. Pursuant to the terms and conditions of your producer contract, this notice shall act as an amendment to your producer contract with respect to timing of payment of commissions. All other terms and conditions of the producer contract shall remain unchanged and in full force and effect.
Should you have any questions, please do not hesitate to contact your FMO, WellCare representative or the WellCare’s PFFS/PDP commission hotline at (866) 383-4324.
Thank you for your continued support of compliant marketing practices,
Kevin A. LeBlanc
Vice President, National Distribution
WellCare Health Plans
Latoya,
I don’t understand how any company that sells medicare advantage plans can amend your contract to say they will pay on an “as earned” basis. The company earns the premium for MA plans on a yearly basis from the government. The government pays the company $2500 a year for each MA plan. Your company is telling you they can’t give you your $325 up front? Doesn’t make sense…
I am really glad I tripped onto this website. It is now in my favs. I have never seen any company having to wait for the government to ok the employees payroll before. Although we are not employees the same idea applies. If this is the way our govenment is going to be run (micromanaged) noone is safe. I heard today that medicare advantage plans are definately out. Does anyone know for sure? Although if this remains this way I really question if I will be able to continue next year. I have the most wonderful clients, and it is really sad that the government is making this so confusing and difficult for them. Whenever the government says they want to help you, you better run for cover. More now than ever.
Thanks again
Cherie:
I don’t think Medicare Advantage plans are out. Some plans will be discontinuing however. I’m hosting a call on May 27th which will shed more light on this. Here is a link which will get you to the info on the Webex I’m hosting.
http://blog.ritterim.com/2009/05/17/ritter-insurance-marketing-finishes-future-of-medicare-seminars-for-pennsylvania-more-meetings-scheduled-soon/
So i called American Progressive last month asking when they were planning on paying out the second half of commissions and i was told that A.P. would be receiving the file from CMS at the end of April so comp would be paid out the first week of May…. haha what a joke. This week on 5/12/09 i called again asking the same question A.P. said “yes we received the file from CMS, our I.T. people are looking it over, there is no set date to when commissions will be paid out…” so i doubt if they will ever pay out these damn commissions. Sure it sucks that CMS is involved and without them we wouldn’t be waiting… however i am becoming more and more skeptical of A.P. maybe they are just using CMS as an excuse not to pay the other half of commissions….
Eric trust me its not just A.P. and not just you. I’ve been doing this for 5.6 years now. Sold so many Med Advantage plans that are still on the books my so called residual income would make you jump for joy, but am I getting it? NO!!! Why not you may ask. I have no freakin Idea. The company I work for has told us for the past few years that there was a glitch in the carriers system that they are STILL fixing. Sure, and I’m an idiot right. Don’t answer that please. Anyway this has so called happen to two of the companies I wrote for Humana and United Healthcare at the same time, for the same duration. Any suggestions?
Eric,
I got an email today from the FMO that I am contracted with for UPMC for life that their interpretation of CMS guidance says that they should only pay “intial” years commissions on people that have never had a Part D plan. UPMC for life considers anyone that has ever had a Part D as being in the Medicare Advantage program and thus not eligible for first year commissions. This would mean, according to UPMC for life, that almost all of our enrollments would be regarded as a renewal sale unless of course someone just went on Medicare. This is contradictory to any information I have read on this blog or I have received from other Medicare Advantage companies.
I had my contract cancelled with UPMC for life immediately. They pay their brokers much less than the competition anyhow.
Mike,
I’m confused are you saying that even if the client is a first time enrollee that A.P. isn’t going to be paying out the second half of commissions?
Eric:
I think replied, but I’m quite sure AP will be sending out the second 1/2 of commissions soon. Most companies seem to be trying to get this done by month end, some think it will be paid out on the cycle ending this week. Nothing specific on AP, but I’m checking through a whole boatload of e-mails as I was out of my office last week.
Craig
Eric,
It is UPMC for life. I will send you the email I received from them if you give me your email address. I am not concerned about them in particular because I did not write any business with them but I am concerned that other companies might try and do the same thing. Basically they are saying is if a medicare recipient had either Part C or Part D when you enrolled them, they are only going to pay renewal rates for those people. In essence, that would eliminate almost all people most of us signed up for a MA only or MAPD program. Based on UPMC for life’s interpretation of CMS guidance, broker would only get paid first year commissions on people new to the Medicare program, i.e, people turning 65 or people just getting Medicare A&B due to disability.
I think UPMC for life is attempting to rip off the agents and they are hiding under the verbage put out by CMS to avoid having to pay additional broker commissions.
Mike:
I re-read the CMS Guidance and I don’t think that UPMC is correct here.
Here is the December 24th letter (see the bottom of page 2 and onto page 3 http://ritterim.files.wordpress.com/2009/01/commissionsmemo12-24.pdf.
Here is a direct quote from the November 14th Interim Final Guidance: “However, if an enrollee
moves to a plan of a different plan type
(as defined in 422.2274(a)(3)(ii) and
423.2274(a)(3)(ii)) within the existing
organization, the agent or broker may
receive compensation at the initial rate.”
PDP and MAPD are different “Plan Types” as defined by 422.2274 etc.
Here is the complete document: http://edocket.access.gpo.gov/2008/pdf/E8-27041.pdf
See page 3.
To all:
I am sick and tired of checking this blog and reading a bunch of useless comments.
How about no one post anything untill they get paid. When you get paid, come to the blog tell us who paid you (carrier not FMO), how much (i.e. 1/1 effectives or 2/1; 3/1; 4/1 too) and if your check is right or is it short. Thats it.
I don’t want to see people soliciting memberships to the illuminati or bitching about Part D not working because they tried to get an extra supply of oxycotin on it. Junkies go to another website please.
Also, the solicitation for class action law suites and forming a union are useless too. Top producers know that the only thing top producers like to spend money on is their families and leads. Thats it. They are not going to pay union dues and they’re not going to split their commissions with some lawyer.
As for the political BS, post that noise somewhere else. There are pleanty of political blogs out there where you can post a copy of your letter to the pres.
I know that agents had to bear an unfair burden this year and its a burden that no agent should ever have to bear but it is what it is. Vent up to your FMO and your manager. Posting your anger on this site will not do anything for you and frankly I’m tired of reading about it.
Again, please feel free to post any conversations you had with Managment or Home Office Personnel and please post any payments but keep the BS to yourself.
Thanks!
Craig,
Well said… See if you click on this link. This is what UPMC for life is telling their brokers about Initial year commissions.
http://us.mc01g.mail.yahoo.com/mc/welcome?.gx=1&.rand=3edt0fcdalh7o#_pg=showMessage&pSize=25&sMid=5&fid=Inbox&sort=date&order=down&startMid=0&filterBy=&.rand=767569889&midIndex=5&mid=1_29904310_ADIlvs4AASsaSgw5vgkf3SxOFpw&m=1_29906228_ADclvs4AAUZwSgxEiAIvrQW4na4,1_29905571_ADYlvs4AARkQSgw%2Bcw7eV1FzqOQ,1_29903528_ADAlvs4AAB%2BVSgw4AALODU337l8,1_29902989_ADIlvs4AAQ65Sgw26gEyznIQQJ4,1_29905024_ADIlvs4AAS6LSgw6PAMfzw14ogs,1_29904310_ADIlvs4AASsaSgw5vgkf3SxOFpw,1_29902356_ADglvs4AAOfqSgwuqgMnrx0D2pg,1_29901546_ADklvs4AALOhSgwt3ANQtkXGWr8,1_29900830_ADMlvs4AANMVSgwopQ8C6XzjneM,1_29899498_ADUlvs4AAKCsSgwjdgjlKU5GU7U,1_29898783_ADUlvs4AAEQLSgwb%2BAPTRzULRqk,&hash=95d4e68ec20431e796f8e6a8281e547c&.jsrand=1471084
Mike,
I can not click on your email from UPMC please forward it to me at my e-mail edward.bohan@gmail.com. If you go to the federal code 422.2274(a)1iii and 423.2274(A)1iii you will see in black and white that if a person is new to a medicare advantage coming from a PDP that you are going to get the full commission. Do not take their word for it. I would fight for it. Thanks, Kristin
We received an email today that Coventry is projecting/expecting to pay the remainder of the NEW TO MED ADV Commissions on or around 5/22/2009.
Please do yourself and your client justice. If they can afford a Medicare Supplement sell it to them and tell them to stay far away from Advantage plans. I have sold close to 200 advantage plans in a short time and I regret them all.(except for the few who could not afford a Med Supp ) Too many problem !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! Not just pay for us but problems for the client !!!!! I have been selling to seniors for 10 years and I’ve never seen so much bull !!!!!!!!!!!